1

Topic: Linux development tools

Not sure this belongs here, but it's close.

I've been thinking about migrating my development environment to linux. At least the web application parts.

So I installed the latest free Redhat distribution (9) and proceeded to look for a tool that provided me both a WYSIWYG and syntax highlighting environment.

I've heard about Quanta, but I'm finding lots of problems because I need several libraries which need several libraries... you see the problem?
So, while I'm there installing more and more packages every day, has anybody hints about what development environtments have good functionality for linux?

Re: Linux development tools

What language/languages will you be developing in?

"Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."

3

Re: Linux development tools

only standard web apps: html, xml, asp, php, cfs and the like. all possible variants included. Not all developed apps will run on linux servers, but that shouldn't be relevant, test environments are ftp accessible.

Syntax extensions shouldn't be a major problem if we're talking opensource and it's already present. The interesting part is class management and WYSIWYG.

Anyway, if there are several possibilities, I'll try them all and judge what. If there's a site with comprehensive listings of linux only development environments, that works ok as well.

4

Re: Linux development tools

Nevermind, I'm giving up. I seem to be unable to install the appropiate packages, it seems to be impossible without a major uninstall of the whole KDE and others. And I thought I was experienced... well, I guess you have to learn the hard way sometimes. sad

Re: Linux development tools

As far as I know, there aren't any good WYSIWYG tools for web development on the *nix platform. I can't even name one.

"Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."

6 (edited by MarcB 2004-03-19 07:43)

Re: Linux development tools

Well, I managed to install an older version of Quanta, which seems to do ok.
However, yesterday I was totally unable to install the newest version which offers much extended php support (or so they said in the webpage).

So... I'm trying today smile

I really don't need a too fancy environment to work out, just to be able to see what I'm doing in case I make a mistake, and good search capabilities within code. And file management, and if possible css support (that is, ease of use :-).

Re: Linux development tools

Eclipse is cool, but it's more of a code editor than a WYWIWYG tool.

"Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."

8

Re: Linux development tools

Rickard wrote:

Eclipse is cool, but it's more of a code editor than a WYWIWYG tool.

Eclipse also runs on Windows so you could try it out before deciding if it's worth trying to install it on Linux. Otherwise you seem to have hit the well known "very pretty but I can't get a damn thing done" Linux bug.

9

Re: Linux development tools

Weeell, might be partly my fault. You see, last time I used Linux, you had to recompile everything if you wanted to get past the lilo boot prompt. So I'm used to pretty much do things as I want. I read in redhat that v9 was their latest free stable release, so I went for that one instead of Fedora, cause if it works, the machine will be production. Of course I don't see the point in paying for linux, in that case I'd rather stay with MS, so the enterprise version was excluded.

The thing is, I was wrong. v9 is somewhat dead, and the new KDE and the likes won't install over it. I now have a mixed Fedora core 1/Redhat v9 install... where KDE seems to hiccup every now and then.

Since the latest Quanta thing will work only on the latest KDE... you see the problem, right? Now I'm DLing the whole Fedora core 1 release, and will see what I can do with that.

Well, I'd say with Windows you install everything and it runs and you don't know what the hell's going on inside (I remember when they started to seriously use the registry with Win95... nobody knew how that worked). With linux, either you learn from the start how everything works, or you won't be able to do anything done smile

I've stumbled into a couple of very nice tools, though, that serve to ease the pain of package dependency checking when updating one package:

Have you ever heard the term RPM hell? Well forget it. This "apt" package brings Debian's excellent package management system to Red Hat. And as a bonus there is a cool graphical front end. RPMS have never been easier. Keeping your system updated has never been easier. Installing the coolest Linux apps has never been easier. apt for RPM along with http://www.freshrpms.net/ are two Red Hat must haves.

I'd add the GUI Sinaptic to that, but that's a very nice tool that checks repositories and updates all necessary packages... when possible, that is sad

I'll check Eclipse as well. The WYSIWYG part is important to me only because I can easily move around to find the controls I need to change.

Re: Linux development tools

My suggestion is this. Skip Red Hat and install Gentoo. Then you can build the packages you need through the excellent "FreeBSD style" ports system Portage. It has very nice dependency support. If a package requires another package, that one will be downloaded and built automatically. Also, I would definately go with Gnome instead of KDE, but I guess that's a matter of taste.

"Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."

Re: Linux development tools

If you're not afraid for a little manual work during the installation process, do as Kennel says and try Gentoo. Their packet system is very easy to use and they seem to have recent version of almost all their pakages.

"Real programmers are those that can sleep in front of terminals ... with their eyes opened."

"Real programmers don't work from 9 to 5. If any real programmers are around at 9am it's because they were up all night."

12

Re: Linux development tools

Awww after all the time I've invested in getting this little critter up & running... after all the (still ongoing) recompilations... after installing everything for the second time... after browsing the net for every bit of info... after hacking the apt install tool... you want me to change distributions? Ouch, that hurts wink

Might try that one, I'll go fetch the info. But now I really know a lot about rpms, apt, yum, and other little helpers.

I'm really not that happy with kde, but I really wanted to try the Quanta tool, which seems to be very interesting. Fortunately kde apps do work with the gnome environment... but I still need to update the required packages or the app won't install.

However, I must say that the linux kernel has definitively grown since I last compiled it (one of the 1.x versions), it took 2-3 hours to compile the 2.6 version on a PIII-500!!! It used to take minutes on much older machines. Is that normal, or an effect of doing it within a terminal on the GUI instead of directly on a console?

Re: Linux development tools

MarcB wrote:

However, I must say that the linux kernel has definitively grown since I last compiled it (one of the 1.x versions), it took 2-3 hours to compile the 2.6 version on a PIII-500!!! It used to take minutes on much older machines. Is that normal, or an effect of doing it within a terminal on the GUI instead of directly on a console?

That really sounds like a long time, I don't remember how long time it took to compile 2.6 on my 2500+ but with Linux 2.4 it takes about 5-10min. On my P75 Linux 2.4 took around 1-2 hours.

"Real programmers are those that can sleep in front of terminals ... with their eyes opened."

"Real programmers don't work from 9 to 5. If any real programmers are around at 9am it's because they were up all night."

Re: Linux development tools

Yeah, that doesn't sound right. I compiled 2.6.4 an hour ago on my PIII-450 and it took 16 minutes (plus 4 minutes for the modules).

"Programming is like sex: one mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life."

15

Re: Linux development tools

Not sure on the kernel compile, but here's what I got on other fronts.

Package dependencied are similar to the .dll hell in the good 'ol days of windows. Gentoo is by far the best for its BSD stlye port system.

As for a gui, KDE is a grahics, and memory hog. It bogs down my system. I run GNOME when need to do some hard core crap, but for daily usage, I use fluxbox, by Far the best out there.

Do, or do not.

Re: Linux development tools

Yeah.. fluxbox is very nice :) To bad you can't use it in windows :P

17 (edited by zc923 2004-03-22 23:38)

Re: Linux development tools

Jansson wrote:

To bad you can't use it in windows tongue

Actually, someone ported blackbox to work as your windows shell.

http://www.desktopian.org/bb/

Have fun!

Edit: Now that I search, there are a couple of them out there.

Do, or do not.

18 (edited by Jansson 2004-03-23 18:20)

Re: Linux development tools

Yeah, but i want fluxbox :P And I never seem to find the registerkey to boot blackbox instead of explorer :P

Btw, that blackbox port seems nice :P



Wow.. I'm running BB4Win now and it's grrreeeeat! :D

19

Re: Linux development tools

Jansson wrote:

Wow.. I'm running BB4Win now and it's grrreeeeat! big_smile

Haha, glad you like!

Do, or do not.

20

Re: Linux development tools

i tried installing gentoo a few weeks ago and was scurred off by the fstab and lilo configs... that and the kernel compile scurred me for a min too. then i back tracked a min then did the visual and installed anything.. lol.. anyways.. back on topic..

just download slackware. ;-)
(or current slackware from http://slackware.no )
and install that.. its IMHO the best dirsto.. and there hasnt been a thing i couldnt get working after a './configure' 'make' 'make install'
just my two cents