Topic: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Paid Punbb modification/extension work

We will soon be supporting official extensions and modifications to Punbb. The community will most likely help with small mods, however some people require larger modifications to Punbb.  This is where members, who are part of the extension group can do the work in exchange for money.

Pricing
Everyone will have a different opinion on how much a modification should cost, and this can vary on the members coding level, time availability, and the situation.  So it is best to contact a majority of the official paid workers to get different quotes. *Should members make a post in a new forum, and then the workers can reply with their quote?*

Agreement
Both members must agree the common set of rules and statements stating what will be done. This can include:

  • Price

  • Deadline

  • Support After

  • Payment method/Currency

  • User requirements

  • Contact

Support
The support of the modification only supports what is stated in an agreement. Its recommend that the agreement stats support should cover everything up to the user requirements. Anything beyond that, we recommend developers to support, however aren’t required to support the modification after.

Payment
It is recommended that 50% of the agreed price should be after the agreement has be set but before work has started. Then once the project has been finished the rest of the money will be exchanged for the files and source code.

NOTE: Please be aware of the currencies that members might pay in.

Distribution
Because of the licence that Punbb is under, Any work carried out  on it can be redistributed freely. So once payment has been made, the requesting person can freely distribute the files that have been paid for. The developer may ask for the files not to be redistributed, though they don’t have a leg to stand on legally, the developer may not wish to offer future support and developments to you.

Code Quality
Its is important for the quality of code to be at high standards. Developers should use commenting where possible to state what is happing and should have neat source files. Security is important and mods should use Punbb methods of security.  Code is recommended to be W3C valid.

Live servers
It is recommended that modification developers have a live server that can be viewed by the requester (at certain times, or freely) online. This will allow the requester to see what they are paying for.

Requester code
In some cases the requester might wish to have their personal source code modified. In cases like this, the requester should give a copy of the DB (with limited data (posts/forums/bans) and an admin user account with the password stated in the agreement) and files (with config.php cleaned for sensitive information)

If the requester wishes to give the developer access to their own live server then this should be limited access.


One possible idea is me developing an extension for Punbb.infomer.com to support the paid extensions, So all this information is on a form that the user can submit and will alert all extension developers, and they can quote if they are able to do the requested project. And once both members have agreed that payment has been sent/received then the files can be transfused.

Any comments and suggestions are welcome. If you would like to be part of the group then please Email me.

Sorry. Unactive due to personal life.

2 (edited by KeyDog 2009-01-11 16:07)

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Like the idea. Think you should indeed proceed with such an extension to Puunbb.informer ! Build it and they will come big_smile


EDIT:

I would also recommend you put an official sticky topic list of

people who do

STYLES
MODS
EXTENSIONS
SMILIES
CODING

against payment

in that new extension you're talking about.

3 (edited by downliner 2009-01-16 12:50)

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Sounds good. I think this is on-topic: I'd be interested in having access to a paid support forum where I can post my extensions/mods/styles for inspection by other developers. I'd happily pay a monthly fee, or on a per-request basis, for my own code to be (somewhat thoroughly) looked at and have suggested improvements offered smile

Also please can someone clarify the license terms from a buyers perspective. If I'm being charged $500 for a major extension by another dev I'll be pretty ducked off if the developer then releases it for free the very next day lol

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Also please can someone clarify the license terms from a buyers perspective. If I'm being charged $500 for a major extension by another dev I'll be pretty ducked off if the developer then releases it for free the very next day

It's an interesting issue. If he plans on doing that he should tell you so from outset (honor codex?). But, you might need it for a client of yours  who in turn is paying you - so in some cases you might not mind if he publishes it after. Lots of ways of looking at it.

You'd never legaly be able to "get him" for it though. You could maybe have him banned from this forum in such a case where he agreed not to and then still did. But that leaves loads of doors open: posting in another name, posting from different IP etc etc. Posting in another forum altogether. Uncontrollable isn't it?

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

it's interesting, but the system for sell the mod, style and extension? E-commerce? or?

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

As a forum owner who would like extensions made (and supported), this is an excellent idea!

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

KeyDog wrote:

Also please can someone clarify the license terms from a buyers perspective. If I'm being charged $500 for a major extension by another dev I'll be pretty ducked off if the developer then releases it for free the very next day

It's an interesting issue. If he plans on doing that he should tell you so from outset (honor codex?). But, you might need it for a client of yours  who in turn is paying you - so in some cases you might not mind if he publishes it after. Lots of ways of looking at it.

You'd never legally be able to "get him" for it though. You could maybe have him banned from this forum in such a case where he agreed not to and then still did. But that leaves loads of doors open: posting in another name, posting from different IP etc etc. Posting in another forum altogether. Uncontrollable isn't it?


Because of the GPL licence that Punbb is under, there is no legal way to stop people releasing code, whether its paid for, or not. however its down to trust. I will not be letting anyone on the paid work group if I feel that they will mess around, or manipulate the guidelines.

I would say that by default the code that is developed may not be given to anyone else, unless the requester says otherwise!

Sorry. Unactive due to personal life.

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

hmm, so when will this group start smile

~Cereal
I've finally learned what "upward compatible" means. It means we get to keep all our old mistakes.
The limits of language are the limits of one's world.

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Try and keep in mind that the more freely available extensions are the faster the community will increase. If there are loads of extensions around no one knows about it's a shame.

Or maybe one could add them to a list of 'paid' extensions (official, unofficial, paid).

That way people wanting a certain extension can see easily if there's something similiar around.

Also; if I've paid 200€/$/£ for dev of extension XYZ, if that dev sells a nearly unchanged version of it for 100 - shouldn't my price go down or I be compensated to a certain extent? That would ensure people who have the idea for the extension but can't do it themselves also have an incentive for helping grow extension use....

I think you should keep track of what is being sold/made Utchin. It's not in the interest of community otherwise. There's a way to get ext devs paid and give people buying specific ones a fair deal.

But I guess that's incompatible with GPL licence (selling certain extensions over and over?)

10

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

KeyDog wrote:

Try and keep in mind that the more freely available extensions are the faster the community will increase. If there are loads of extensions around no one knows about it's a shame.

I am reccommending this method not for extensions. I am recommending modifications and stuff to be done publicly, so that they are freely available. But this is for people who have rather unique needs. This would be stuff that is only needed on a one off client. A modification that could benefit others should be done freely.

And yeah I do have plans to keep on top of this. I am developing the system at the moment to handle this, however it will be done via External emails as the PM system at the moment doesn't have the required features, such as attachments and forwarding to emails. So this will mean I wont have compleate controll over it, however I will try to contact requesters and see how its getting on.

Sorry. Unactive due to personal life.

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Wow, great. I'd be willing to pay for some modifications... maybe an e-commerce mod would be cool too, although probably a lot of better options for it.

Check Maid maid service

12 (edited by KeyDog 2009-01-27 08:05)

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Utchin wrote:

A modification that could benefit others should be done freely.

I think admins who run non profit sites, i.e. without adds should be using extensions for free. However extensions that are run on commercial (ad-financed) sites should remember that their site wouldn't be attracting revenue and users if it wasn't for people at PunBB (Devs) and Ext Devs.

So I think PunBB should actively encourage people who are making money to give back to the project (PunBB) and also not forget the ext devs (garciat, rich pedley, yonash, cereal etc).

Extensions are the most efficient way for a dev to fullfill needs of many users in easy way.

Also:

Utchin wrote:

I am recommending modifications and stuff to be done publicly, so that they are freely available. But this is for people who have rather unique needs. This would be stuff that is only needed on a one off client.

But who's going to judge what is needed one off? With so many PunBB running in so many countries the need is likely to be several places. You might not think you need something until you actually see it.

For me it seems like a no-brainer that extensions (& mods) are what drives users and admins using site.  So ext devs (PunBB or Independent) need to know that something's being done to promote them at least. Otherwise they loose interest. (My opinion)

Specific Example:
I have Pun_Attachment and would like to be able to have users upload either pictures (and then see them) or videoclips (the videoclips then playback via FLV Player extension). I'm sure many people not using PunBB currently would find something like that attractive. But if I have stuff like that programmed I don't really want to finance it on my own. I'm also confident that if 1000 people used it, at least 1-3% would be willing to donate 10-20$ for it. So that would be anything between 100-600$. Also possible that only 20 people used it, but were so keen they'd all pay 30$.
Just trying to say: Some kind of pooling should be added to this paid punbb work... Not only for the people looking to mod their site and not share the mod/extension.

Make sense?

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

downliner wrote:

Also please can someone clarify the license terms from a buyers perspective. If I'm being charged $500 for a major extension by another dev I'll be pretty ducked off if the developer then releases it for free the very next day Last edited by downliner (2009-01-16 18:20:39)

There's more to the problem:
* If the programmer got paid $500 and he thought that was great and all, and the next week, the buyer sells the extension in another place, with another name, maybe offline too, then what?
* What if a newbie programmer has some cash and gets this done by a programmer for $500 and then he goes on to sell it at $50 or $100 to 10-20 clients?
What if programmers disguise as buyers and do this? All this actually happens out there. Many newbie programmers can hack a bit to get the thing working. So, now the original programmer feels cheated. Then he releases a better version with 10% more code. Then buyer claims that he's violated the agreement. It's endless and troublesome.
* I wonder what Linux vendors do to earn their money. Support is said to be the way to earn money. I think webhosting companies must employ/contract extension devs to handle client requests which are always there. That way, there'll be an increase in support quality - which can be charged for to the end user - and there'll be work for devs too.
* The solution called (L)GPL is so big that it needs a big problem to solve. That is the catch. We have to identify the big problem that this big solution solves. In my mind, that big problem is making all data available online in various formats for end users - in short, innovation of features that people will pay for.

In the short term we probably have to copy the model followed by other forum boards - they seem to be doing well with contract breaches not reported much. This is a very good point for discussion. Please continue this discussion.

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

Try and keep in mind that the more freely available extensions are the faster the community will increase. If there are loads of extensions around no one knows about it's a shame.

Or maybe one could add them to a list of 'paid' extensions (official, unofficial, paid).

That way people wanting a certain extension can see easily if there's something similiar around.

Also; if I've paid 200€/$/£ for dev of extension XYZ, if that dev sells a nearly unchanged version of it for 100 - shouldn't my price go down or I be compensated to a certain extent? That would ensure people who have the idea for the extension but can't do it themselves also have an incentive for helping grow extension use....

I think you should keep track of what is being sold/made Utchin. It's not in the interest of community otherwise. There's a way to get ext devs paid and give people buying specific ones a fair deal. http://www.ugg2u.net

But I guess that's incompatible with GPL licence (selling certain extensions over and over?)

15 (edited by StevenBullen 2009-09-04 18:28)

Re: Paid Punbb modification/extension work

If anyone would like any paid work done for their forum, Please Email me, Utchin(AT)punbb.org And Ill get back to you.

Thanks.

EDIT: I have un-stuck the topic by the way.

Sorry. Unactive due to personal life.