Rickard - no joke, I just started my own translation yesterday (without seeing this guy first). I'd love to collaborate on something like this. After all, ju pli da homoj, des pli bona (the more people, the better)
26 2005-02-23 14:53
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
27 2005-02-23 10:50
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Okay, Jonex. You win, man
Oh, and by the way, it's 'gramatiko' in Esperanto. 'Gramatika' is 'grammatical', 'gramatike' is 'gramatically'.
And excellent point, KTottE, I certainly hear you on that. I just meant when it comes to having an accent, rapid-fire fluent speech, stumbling/stuttering, mixing verb forms, etc.
28 2005-02-23 10:11
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Wow, Jonex, you don't know what you're talking about Read up on Esperanto first, okay?
1: It sounds like Spanish/Italian due to the large concentration of vowel sounds. There's no bias toward the Spanish/Italians. AT ALL.
2: Any computer in the world can type the accented characters. The accented characters are there to give the language phoneticy, so instead of having two letters for one sound (like sh, which is a digraph, Esperanto has s with a hat on top). It has nothing to do with French.
3: First, it's grammar, not gramatics (which shows you how much you don't know about English and just how difficult it really is), and secondly, why English? You yourself can't even speak it properly.
29 2005-02-23 08:42
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
In that case, we should use Esperanto so you don't feel disadvantaged next to me, a native speaker of 19 years. Although I must say, in written form your English is great!
30 2005-02-23 02:47
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
When is 'j' ever pronounced like 'y' by the way? I've never encountered that, sounds weird
Also, esperanto will most likely develop regional dialects when it's usage reaches the levels that english has reached. Regional dialects are not a function of the language used, but by the mentality of people. And I don't think you will change that any time soon
J is y in my friend's name, "Jana" It's in a few other words too, but, as always, when I need an example, one never comes...ah well.
And I don't want to keep going with the 'dialects' argument, but, if people are educated in Esperanto, knowing how and when to use it (for example, you and I wouldn't use it with each other as we're both native speakers of English, but I'd use it with a Japanese native speaker), dialects won't develop. Believe me on that - slang and strange usages occur only in natural languages. Esperanto's been spoken since 1887 and it hasn't done this yet, and I'm pretty sure it won't happen.
If anyone is interested (you know, on the off chance ), http://www.esperanto.net has a lot of cool information.
31 2005-02-21 22:33
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Esperanto uses the Latin alphabet (that's the same as English's alphabet), but doesn't use w, x, q, or y, and has a couple other letters with 'hats' on them, like the French do. You can type it using any keyboard, and, if for some reason you can't use the hats (because you're not supporting UTF-8 encoding, *cough*), the official 'workaround' is to use 'h' after the letter, much like you use 'e' after a German vowel to show that it has an umlaut.
Esperanto is as widespread as English, it just doesn't have the same number of speakers...Esperanto is spoken in at least 85 countries and has an estimated 8 million speakers. However, that number may be bigger now, as it's taken from my 1999 edition of "Teach Yourself Esperanto", but really it doesn't matter. It's like asking, "How many people play chess?" - nobody knows, and it doesn't matter.
As to you seeing Esperanto being no different from English as a second language...look at this:
Drink
Drank
Drunk
but not
Think
Thank
Thunk
Computer - Computers
but not
Mouse - Mouses
Eight different ways of pronouncing 'ough', 'g' sometimes being 'j', 'j' sometimes being 'y' and 'x' sometimes being 'z' or even 'sh'! Irregularities among dialects (I didn't do anything vs I didn't do nothing), a vocabulary that's swollen rather than rich and it taking a lifetime to master rather than a few months/a year...et cetera. It's just not suitable.
As you can see, English is full of irregularities, weird spellings and grammatical burdens. Esperanto is streamlined, has a vocabulary common to all European languages and no irregular verbs/grammar rules at all. It's the only spoken language of its kind, and is in the Guiness Book of Records as the only language with no irregular verbs. With 16 grammar rules (yep, that's all...versus the countless number of rules in English) and 400 'root words', you can understand and be understood in about 80% of the language. The rest you pick up as you go. I became fluent in a year, practising only an hour a day. It really is that simple.
Oh, and about the French parasite thing - I mentioned the French thinking English to be a parasite language because the English language is associated with American culture. The French are a proud nation and won't tolerate that (they won't use our word "e-mail", for example, as they see it as too American. They'll make up their own word instead. Same goes for MANY techincal terms). Esperanto belongs to no nation, has no cultural bias and is for everybody. That is why they wouldn't see it as a parasite language.
32 2005-02-20 22:48
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Esperanto's been around for over 100 years, has millions of speakers, and it hasn't split into dialects. This is because people tend to create slang and idioms in their own language, whereas with Esperanto, the idea is to be understood across all nations/countries/cultures.
For example - in Esperanto, you can't say "it's raining cats and dogs". That means, "there are cats and dogs falling from the sky"...it's literal. You'd say instead, "pluvegas", that is, "there's heavy rain". It's like if we were to say in English, "I've got a pig!", it'd mean just that, rather than "Man I'm lucky!" like it does in German.
Sure, there are diffferent ways of speaking, but it's not like the differences between British English and, say, Ebonics. And we have slang (we're not THAT boring ), but not to such an extreme as there is in English. For example, a tarted up woman is a christmas tree, and if you're drunk you're blue. These usages are discouraged, though, but seem to be generally understood and timeless (unlike slang in English, which seems to change every generation)
On the sound of Esperanto, it DOES kind of sound like Spanish/Italian, mostly due to the high concentration of vowel sounds. Words end in a or o depending on whether they're an adjective or noun, and e if they're an adverb. Verb endings are done by as is os (present, past, future), and so yeah, there's a sort of Spanishy flavour.
33 2005-02-20 21:45
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Imagine a world where we all spoke TWO languages - our native, and one common language that we used between those who didn't know our own.
Say, for example, that you're French. You're proud of your French heritage, and see English as a parasite language that's a poison. You refuse to speak it. I'm Australian, and so I speak English. I see the French language as too "poofy" and flowery, and I refuse to speak that.
However, if we both spoke ANOTHER language, such as Esperanto...we could communicate. More than that, we could communicate on LEVEL GROUND. I speak Japanese, and I speak it pretty well. However, whenever I'm speaking with a native Japanese speaker, I always feel a little lower than them, and I know the reverse is true when they speak English with me. But if we were both to use a language that we don't speak natively, neither would have an advantage over the other.
The cool thing about Esperanto though, is that it's so simple and easy that even though it's your second language, you can speak it as well as you speak your first. I've got a Viet Namise friend with whom I speak Esperanto all the time - I kind of have to, as she speaks no English and I speak no Viet Namise. It's really a phenominal experience.
But, I digress - I support world bi-lingualism, not world monolingualism. Keep your own language and use that in your country and with people you already speak that with, thus preserving the culture your language has, and speak Esperanto (or another bridge language), that's neutral, doesn't give any advantages to any one country/ethnic group, and facilitates business and cultural understanding.
34 2005-02-20 09:36
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
But how would I do that using English as my input language?
There are hundreds of programs out there that let you convert one language's keystrokes into another. I use Mac OS X, and all I have to do is change the little Australian flag up there in the menu bar to a Japanese one (or an Esperanto one, or a French one, or a Chinese one, or even to the Dvorak keyboard). There's a Japanese converter thing on Windows called JStar, I think. Look it up, it's really simple.
35 2005-02-19 13:10
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Jameslicious wrote:I seriously hope you're kidding, Rickard.
I have a Japanese domain (using katakana), and one in Esperanto. They're fantastic. I understand where this article is coming from, but I can't say I agree with it.
But what if I want to visit your Japanese domain?
You...type it into your addressbar?
36 2005-02-18 01:33
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
Gary - Esperanto, maybe?
Don't tell me it's dead, I've been fluent in it for two years and have many friends who are the same. Hell, my fianceé and I speak it at home.
37 2005-02-18 01:18
Re: Mozilla Drops Support for International Domains (36 replies, posted in General discussion)
I seriously hope you're kidding, Rickard.
I have a Japanese domain (using katakana), and one in Esperanto. They're fantastic. I understand where this article is coming from, but I can't say I agree with it.
38 2005-02-16 09:35
Topic: How long between updates? (1 replies, posted in PunBB 1.2 discussion)
Hey guys, I'm new to punbb - I found this place last week after using Xcomic. Anyway, I was just wondering how much time is there between updates, usually? I'm guessing due to pun's philosophy that the time between releases is pretty slow (all the 'needed' features seem to be in place already), and I'm guessing most of the releases are code fixes, things like that.
Sound about right?
-James
39 2005-02-13 12:09
Re: UTF-8 Encoding (3 replies, posted in PunBB 1.2 troubleshooting)
That's cool. Thanks for the quick response, I'll give it a shot.
EDIT: Worked like a charm, thanks SO much.
40 2005-02-13 06:04
Topic: UTF-8 Encoding (3 replies, posted in PunBB 1.2 troubleshooting)
I know, search first...I have, and I still can't find a simple way to make my forum run on utf-8 encoding. I figured it was done by modifying the charset in headers, but, as there's just a bunch of php files...I don't know where to start.
I'm running punbb version 1.2.1 with MySQL version 4.something, if that helps.
Thanks guys, sorry to bust such a n00b question onto you all.
James.