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PunBB Forums → General discussion → Why I sometimes wish I had a Mac
but then again its always going to be a bit after an OS X release since theres one every 5 minutes
Better to fix critical bugs the minute the come out, instead of waiting 10 years to release a new update, which always brings more bugs than it fixes. ;-)
on mac, there's the automatic application update. it checks for updates, invites you to check if you want/need them, checkbox the ones you want, usually no restart, but simetimes one is needed.
sounds like win-update?
"sounds", yes - but a huge NO. Apple...
1. ...informs you very well what is updated and WHY
2. ...includes a thank you to the ppl finding problems/bugs/security issues
3. ...makes the updates small! updating can replace some code in otherwise big packages, so even modem ppl can often do the updates
4. ...makes your box run better after every update, and most the time faster and smoother
5. ...often includes ground-breaking new features which makes life easier - and as a mac is pre-loaded with the coolest apps from the start, this is welcome.
6. ...does not require you to do the updates! As there are NO known viruses for mac os x, nor its apps, no worries!
etc
1-6...sound like windows-update? NO! remember xp sp2 ???
Want a virus- and crash-free smooth life at the puter, one which a techie AND grandma can run with deepest tech-joy AND ease, side-by-side (as user switching really works on osx) - ? - well, get yourself a (new) mac!
now, go jump on me for being so "bold" 
I have trouble liking Macs, but I know I haven't worked with them enough to make any good judgements on them. I took a summer camp a few years ago for learning how to record music. They used a Mac based system. I just couldn't get over how buggy Cubase is on that system. I could have listed 30 things that were wrong with that program. But I shouldn't judge the system by one software. Macs sound really good after having your computer spontainiously crash every two seconds.
I have trouble liking Macs, but I know I haven't worked with them enough to make any good judgements on them. I took a summer camp a few years ago for learning how to record music. They used a Mac based system. I just couldn't get over how buggy Cubase is on that system. I could have listed 30 things that were wrong with that program. But I shouldn't judge the system by one software. Macs sound really good after having your computer spontainiously crash every two seconds.
Then again, Cubase is probably one of the buggiest applications ever written for any platform. I used to work on it in Windows and it crashed constantly.
mi: I agree with most of what you said, but the part about there not being any known viruses is just wrong. Apple release security updates all the time to prevent the spread of virus, trojans and other malware. Just have a look at http://www.securemac.com/
I agree with most of what you said, but the part about there not being any known viruses is just wrong. Apple release security updates all the time to prevent the spread of virus, trojans and other malware. Just have a look at http://www.securemac.com/
1. There are security issues with mac osx, as with any os. (Thus, a need for www.securemac.com) But:
2. There are zero viruses made for Mac per se. (Some macro-viruses in microsoft products (Word, Excel) exist and affect Mac, too, but those are made on PCs, no doubt.)
3. In practical life, pragmatically speaking, in my own, and every mac-friend's i have - When using a mac, there is never the need for firewall, anti-virus soft, nor any such security measures.
4. There have been no successful attacks on personal macs, nor any osx servers, save TWO, which were carried out after a reward was announced for a successful hack. In both those cases, the security hole was due to an incorrectly configured Lasso web-application, and long before os X.
5. The main reason why mac-life is virus-free, could be because the installed base is between 6-10% of all puters. Simply not enough interest from hackers to begin to understand such a small base.
6. The main reason so many (100's of thousands?) viruses exist on the PC, is the combination of a/large base and b/the sheer, obvious, ridiculous and seemingly purposedly ill-programmed os.
I could go on and on - but then this Topic could get too big
If this means anything, and hope you take it the right way...(its a compliment!) ::::
PunBB compared to the rest of the BB's out there...in a way it's like comparing Macs to PCs - PunBB is minimalistic but 100% functional, clean, lean, and fast - the other BBs...well you know
(side-note: i had a long conversation with a microsoft network engineer [who has taken every certificate issued by m¢] about why windows os is so insecure and such a patchy jiq-saw-puzzle which no-one percieves the full picture of. He said in plain Swedish: "It's because they want it this way, as it a/enprisons companies using windows to where they feel there's no way out and b/it creates JOBS, both for m¢ and the millions of consultants and companies needed for support of their products.)
ps
Cubase and other huge sound/audio apps for osx now work flawlessly. It is still the platform of choice for the majority of the audio and music community. The incorporation of the new AudioUnits etc has helped. The FREE application, preinstalled on every new mac, GarageBand, is an app unprecedented in the combination ease of use/professional results, and for anyone with a mild interest in producing his/her own music, i highly recommend a trial at an Apple retailer close to you - a weekend leisurly browse thru www.apple.com/ilife/ will show you - not advertising hype - but the actual real life possibilities with a mac as a box which simplifies all areas of our modern digital lives. On the server side of things, www.apple.com/server/macosx/ is too - no advertising hype - but real and top notch server stuff which even i myself can install, run, and maintain, from www-server to mySql, PHP, DNS Server, etc - without so much as one hour in training, not one hang/restart ever, hardly any command-line configging, and most importantly; not ONE problem with virus or attacks of any kind, in spite of no firewall, no anti-virus....etc.
I'm going to have to disagree with the system of choice for audio statement. Windows and Macs both are equally as capable for working with audio and have software which is very professional on both sides. However, many tend to stick to Pro Tools, not because it is any better than another software, but because it has a name.
Once upon a time, you could probably make such a statement that Macs were better for audio, but that was in the days when Pcs were tweaked to work in the office. I prefer windows based recording software such as Sonar.
6-10%? Make that 1-2%. Please not that I'm not saying this is good in any way.
6-10%? Make that 1-2%. Please not that I'm not saying this is good in any way.
That was the market share of only Q3 2004. The installed user base, as user polls and e.g. Google's browser-checks show, is more like 10%.
I got this interesting operating systems poll, from a bit-torrent site which has 130.000 registered users. Remember that the torrent world was first developed as a PC thing.
http://gr8.se/kdx/pics/os.jpg
In education, some say Mac holds around 1/3 of the installed computer base, but those are mainly US figures. But a rough estimate from ppl (incl. Google) range from a total of 10-15% of all the running computers in the world, including those in the educational sector.
I say this is a good thing, that Mac only has 10%! It's like BMW and Mercedes... I might get a cheaper car in a Vaz/Lada/Fiat - but i will then have to put up with having to turn on the blinkers to be able to open the trunk, roll down a window to adjust the seat, leave the key in the door to open the sun-roof...etc, if you follow my analogy
I am not really a PC/Mac-war soldier. I just love my Mac. And loathe every minute of having to sit by a PC...except when running iTunes, maybe And I do heartily recommend Macs any day, for personal fun AND professional server stuff. You just get more things done with more ease and tons of more fun - virus-free. 10% versus 90% - fine, if 50/50 we'd see a lot more problems with Mac.
I've already stated this once in this topic, but I'll do it again. I like Macs and I would love to have one. I am however, realistic.
Talk is cheap. Show me some statistics to back your claims up. A poll from a torrent site hardly has any bearing. Enough with the "some say" and "a rough estimate from ppl".
Edit: Here are the latest OS statistics I could find for Google. 3%.
Also, you can stop with the "a monkey can operate a Mac" and "you need a degree to operate a PC". It's just not true anymore.
Also, if you like iTunes in Windows, you obviously haven't used a lot of Windows software. You'll have to search high and low to find a slower or buggier software than iTunes in Windows. Well, Quicktime might be even worse. Apple write excellent software for their own operating system, but they should stay away from Windows. The same goes for Microsoft developing software for MacOS.
The same goes for Microsoft developing software for MacOS.
don't you mean
The same goes for Microsoft developing software.
Staying clear of the mac vs pc debate. I use both (work-win, home mac). Love the mac the best for what I use it for, but honestly can't do alot of things we do under windows. Preference - Mac. You'll either love it or hate...room for all.
Note on most security releases- many of these are for for the apache / server side of the OS. I don't think most people are even running the server (off by default- lesson there for MS), so although it sounds bad- many not effected.
Also, if you like iTunes in Windows, you obviously haven't used a lot of Windows software. You'll have to search high and low to find a slower or buggier software than iTunes in Windows.
I never had a single problem with iTunes. The fact is I've search high and low but never found a better one in terms of features, interface and usability.
First - i am sorry if i have sounded like a mac-warrior in this topic. i am not.
Then - whether mac has 3% or 10% of the installed puter base, is something i have no feelings or opinions about really. Win-base having 90-97% doesn't make it better, nor does 3-10% mac-base make it any better or worse. The only reason i talk about it, is that there seems to be an erroneous "trend" in pointing out a supposed scarcity of macs, as I prefer accuracy over generalisations and public opinion, just like you express, too.
Also - since you did request for statistics to back up my statements, which i respect, here is my backup (not to be taken as furthering any argument, but only to show the facts behind the statements):
Concerning security issues on mac and the reference to http://www.securemac.com :
- Plz note the dates of the, in fact, non-issues: Old, few, and far in between, and all "corrected" by os updates, and none exploited. The one attempt made was to prove he could make one, and that one was still not a virus, but a masquerading application which took a double-click to activate.
Concerning the os poll from the torrent-site: 130.000 ppl answering a poll is considered quite meaningful in the world of statistics. Most statistical surveys are done by asking only 1000 ppl or so.
In education, some say Mac holds around 1/3 of the installed computer base, but those are mainly US figures.
The people i was referring to are here: http://www.macobserver.com/article/2002/11/18.15.shtml (nov 2002)
...except when running iTunes, maybe
i will never mention iTunes on windows again here
The Google reference you quote Here has 5% as "Others", 1% Linux, and 3% Mac. Would all "other" os'es outnumber both Mac+Linux together? Obviously no, so those statistics are misleading. I read an article here which corrects the statistical error, and estimates Mac 6%, Linux 2%, and Others 1% - which then makes sense.
But a rough estimate from ppl (incl. Google) range from a total of 10-15% of all the running computers in the world, including those in the educational sector.
The Google corrected 6% plus the educational sector... 10-15% would not be a bad estimate.
Hopefully, i have not caused any heated emotions by all this, i do want to reply to questions, but mainly, i like things the way they are, independent of percentages I am not trying to convert, i only recommend from my own experience.
The only reason i talk about it, is that there seems to be an erroneous "trend" in pointing out a supposed scarcity of macs, as I prefer accuracy over generalisations and public opinion, just like you express, too.
Good. It sure didn't sound like it when you posted your previous message, but sure. I'm with ya.
Concerning the os poll from the torrent-site: 130.000 ppl answering a poll is considered quite meaningful in the world of statistics. Most statistical surveys are done by asking only 1000 ppl or so.
True. 130000 is an impressive base for statistics, but coming from a torrent site, it really has no real-world application. Generating OS statistics from a torrent site is like generating browser statistics from w3.org. Polls also have a tendency to overrepresent minorities. People using Windows usually aren't as proud as Mac users and they are therefore less likely to take the poll.
The people i was referring to are here: http://www.macobserver.com/article/2002/11/18.15.shtml (nov 2002)
The fact that Apple still has a rather large market share in education in the US wasn't news to me. The fact that they, in 2002, had such a large market share was. One must however note the trend which becomes apparent by reading the article. Back in 2002, Dell was "thrashing Apple in terms of new education sales by some 35% to 21% of purchases". I wonder what the status is today.
I might add that at the university where I currently work, we have a total of about 350 computers that students are allowed to use. 4 of these are Macs. If that wasn't bad enought, none of them run Linux or any other UNIX derivate :(
i will never mention iTunes on windows again here ;)
Thanks :) I have trouble sleeping after using it.
The Google reference you quote Here has 5% as "Others", 1% Linux, and 3% Mac. Would all "other" os'es outnumber both Mac+Linux together? Obviously no, so those statistics are misleading. I read an article here which corrects the statistical error, and estimates Mac 6%, Linux 2%, and Others 1% - which then makes sense.
That article is a joke. Claiming, based on his own analysis of osviews.com data with an obviously ill-configured analyzer, that the "other" 5% should represent mainly Macs, is nothing short of nonsense. I'll quote one of the comments:
"The article was interesting unitl the author tried to infer what the breakdown of the "other" 5% was. The existing statistics (95% that we *do* know), give us absolutely no clue as to how to break down the 5%. Looking at ratios of, for example, Macintosh's 3% to "other's" 5% is just totally devoid of logic. It boggles the mind!"
The author clearly has no idea how statistical analysis of web server access logs works. Why write something like that in the first place? It doesn't make sense. Claiming Macs are more popular than they are isn't going to fix the problem. Mac users should try to convince Wintel users WHY MacOS is a better operating system, not conjure up conspiracy theories.
The Google corrected 6% plus the educational sector... 10-15% would not be a bad estimate.
Even though that 6% estimate is completely false, it is still a loooong way from 15%.
Now, lets put an end to this before it does get heated. I actually used a Mac just a few minutes ago. It was pleasant as always :)
i hate macs and windows equally
i love, in order of importance (to me):
1. wife
2. kids
3. mac
i hate, in order of importance (to me):
1. lies/deception/dishonesty
2. things that don't work
3. pc
have a good life. stay with punBB.
edit: whichever way you look at it objectively, it is a very interesting phenomena, what goes on in a mac-persons mind...
small example: just have a look at this - and that is just an opening of a store - did anything like this happen when microsoft released XP/2k/etc...? will it happen when "longhorn" is released, if ever...?
no for a few reasons, 1 do windows have any stores? i thought they just sold through normal shops and 2. everyone will have the next version of windows like 3 weeks before its release from P2P 
2. things that don't work
3. pc
These two things are the same.
Concerning the os poll from the torrent-site: 130.000 ppl answering a poll is considered quite meaningful in the world of statistics. Most statistical surveys are done by asking only 1000 ppl or so.
lol, the poll image you refeered to says 24'366 votes, where on earth did you find 130'000? 
but ... I don't want to get into the mac vs pc thing ... usually arguments are biased and sometimes quite exaggerated
lol, the poll image you refeered to says 24'366 votes, where on earth did you find 130'000?
the site had 130.000 members, at the point in time when i took the screenshot. today they have 150.000+. When i recheck that particular poll, it reads:
http://gr8.se/kdx/pics/os.jpg
27.000 votes (out of 150.000 members on that site)
8% mac
8% linux
1% others
rest is windowsWell .... then when you said that 130'000 had voted, it was a bit exaggerated
Either way, polls willl rarely be 'accurate' for statistics, not 'optional' stats either.
When professional statistic companies base the statistics on 1000 people, they often make alot of work to select the 1000 people representing the area that they will do statistics on. + coverage of different incomes, occupations, ages, carowners, petowners etc...
A poll is there for those that want to participate, and some people will probably be more eager to vote than others
(IMHO, minority groups in general seems to be more happy to advertise their opinions and choises, just look at the internet word of mouth on FF ... and compare it to the WOM of IE ... I guess you'll see my point)
1. my very bad mistake to say 130000 had voted. still, 27000 is not a bad figure
2. in sweden especially, when polls about e.g. government/elections etc are made, random selection is the rule
3. i so agree on the poll thing - i referenced it only as an interesting counterweight, as i did other statistical info - but truly; polls/statistics are difficult things and to me, not important, at the most interesting.
4. i love mac because of how much useful stuff it can do for me, while i can see how rewarding it can be to get the PC to do something useful. THATs the main difference, imho, between the two platforms. So, each to his own, there, i guess
4. i love mac because of how much useful stuff it can do for me
Great. I'm not a convert yet, but if Mac users made that point instead of bashing Windows as if people were still using Windows 95, I'd be a lot closer.
i humbly submit my final (?) contribution to what, in my opinion, is pertinant (i.e. "cutting the crap") info about why choosing a mac is a very "informed" and intelligent decision, both on a personal computing and server level:
http://www.hammarnejd.gr8.se
- look in the mac section of the menu. Much in swedish, but translated in most places. Of course, it is not a mac-evangelizing web site, but just some thoughts gathered over time...
My apologies for the speed to my server. It is purely isp related, or rather file-sharer related, as our area in the woods is infested with them, constantly choking the net, forcing the isp to continually upgrade and ramp up the capacity of his network (subscribers get 2 MBit). I am in constant contact with him, reporting on network issues, and it seems that some peoples' prediction, that p2p will cause the downfall of the internet, is closer to reality than ever before At times when the file-sharers are inactive, the server is every bit as snappy as most others.
Bear in mind - i come from a printing and publishing background, and started on the www/server/php/dns/hosting/-journey only about a year+ ago, but since then, mac os x server has made all these tools and instruments easily available to even one such as ignorant myself:
- own domain and dns server ("the machinery that makes internet tick") [BIND]
- own mail server, for family and friends, virtually spam-free [Cyrus+Postfix+Mailman]
- four www-sites [Apache]
- web-redirection service for a number of ppl around the globe (www.gr8.se) [proprietary]
- web-dav and sftp server, used to host personal www-sites, shared calendars and file-storage
- quicktime streaming server (much like darwin streaming server)
- iTunes streaming to the rest of the puters (one pc, acting as a juke-box, hooked up to the stereo) in the house
- private kdx server
- AND, on this same machine i produce tv-quality dv movies in either iMovie or FinalCutPro, or run any other osx client app - at the same time, no reboot, no noticable delay for internet users, as QOS (Quality Of Service) prioritizes the internet services.
- all the other stuff the server can do, i do not have use for yet, but file-serving windows boxes among many other technologies, may come in handy one day...
- and this machine is a 6 year old box! (g4, 400 mhz), up-times of months, needing rebooting only after major os upgrades, later to be replaced with a faster one - by moving the boot disk to the new machine - done! - no reconfig or anything. (or possibly a one-click cloning to a new/bigger drive, or one with different interface, as the G5 has SerialATA)
THIS all, is what i call a system which can do a lot of useful stuff for me, from scratch, no additional software installed or bought - and it makes it impossible for me to boast about what I have accomplished, rather I can only "boast" about what this [Apple] system can do for me.
Would i have been able to have all this on a win-tel or *nix box. NO, not me! I fully and whole-heartedly respect the win-tel peoples' abilities, who manage to get most of this stuff working on their boxes. *hat OFF*
[/endofstory?]
mi wrote:4. i love mac because of how much useful stuff it can do for me
Great. I'm not a convert yet, but if Mac users made that point instead of bashing Windows as if people were still using Windows 95, I'd be a lot closer.
Top 10 things that save me time on my Mac:
10. iTunes, iCal, iPhoto, etc all work smooth and save me time.
9. No Virus software to mess with
8. Built in screen / region capture to pdf for easily grabbing anything on the screen
7. Sherlock
6. Cool network utility
5. terminal- for the *nix nuts.
4. Right click and do about anything.
3. Security done right and easy.
2. Expose- the ALT-TAB killer
1. Cool App- Quicksilver- anything from bookmarks, to itunes, to addresses, to apps with one keystroke and a few characters
And to waste time-
1. Cool chess game
And I only post this because I've had a few St Pauli girls and bored here in the hotel during another fun week of work travel......
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